Proposed changes to registration regulation to register sonographers (Consultation Closed)

As a sonographer who is working in ontario for more than 12 years , this new regulation will make problem in my career and also effect my family life as well. I'm ARDMS registered and can not take all of exams again in canada with having full time job and two children .I have studied ultrasound in private institute and had to work volunteer for a few years and get ARDMS registered. what should I do ?

I pay membership fee for ARDMS and Sonography canada. we have to pay for CMRTO as well ? 

It can be a good reason for employers to force their staff more than before.

CMRTO response: In the future you will be required to be registered with the CMRTO in order to practise as a diagnostic medical sonographer. There will be a one-year grandparenting period starting in January 2018. You can find out more about the steps and the process on the CMRTO website at www.cmrto.org. We will send out regular ‘DMS Updates’ as the regulations proceed.

The OAMRS and Sonography Canada have provided valuable support and leadership in achieving self-regulation of diagnostic medical sonography in Ontario, and play an important role in advancing the needs of the profession. However, membership in these organizations will not be a requirement for a diagnostic medical sonographer to be registered with the CMRTO and to practise as a DMS in Ontario. Therefore the choice of membership in the OAMRS and Sonography Canada is a personal decision.

I have been a sonographer for 30 plus years. A little longer than we have been trying to become regulated. It is about time sonographers are recognized as a regulated profession. Yes, this will protect the public but I also hope it will protect our profession.In recent years I have seen too many sonographers applying for jobs with ARDMS credentials in many specialties. Unfortunately they lack experience in practical scanning. All these sonographers come from non accredited programs and this needs to stop.I hope regulation can help with this problem.

I understand that the CMRTO is a regulatory body while Sonography Canada is not.  However, none of the responses on this forum have given me any confidence to believe that CMRTO will do anything more for us.  Will CMRTO help us in setting up affordable liability insurance?
Will CMRTO help us further our education through conferences or courses?

I don't see how the annual fee for CMRTO is justified?  A quick look at other healthcare professions such as nursing seems to show that the annual fees that you are asking of us are unusually high.  I'd like to see a breakdown of where our money is going when nothing is going to change for the majority of the members.

CMRTO response: The CMRTO is a regulatory body, and membership with the CMRTO will provide sonographers with the legal authority to practise diagnostic medical sonography in Ontario, when the regulation comes into effect. The CMRTO protects the public by setting standards of practice for the profession, setting entry to practice requirements for applicants, ensuring the continued competence of members and addressing concerns from the public.

Currently a student with Burwin Institute. Will Burwin be a approuved education formation for general ultrasound? 

What about for echocardiography? 

Thank you 

I am a Canadian sonographer trained at an accredited ultrasound school. I agree with the other people who also believe that the entry to this profession needs to be regulated. Even though ARDMS is a well-established registry board in North America, it's exams are based on the American practice and not Canadian's. Grandparenting should be granted to those people who are also registered with Sonography Canada. Of course, there needs to be a way for people who have practiced before the existence of Sonography Canada to transfer their American or foreign credentials to Sonography Canada by passing Sonography Canada exams.

hi 

I agree with this amendment 

If any sonographer is  working  in ontario  but have  NO  ARDMS ,  HE /she can be eligible to enter in to grandparenting  period/

I am pleased to see that Ultrasound practice will be finally regulated under CMRTO. I definately think it's important to protect the public and have competent sonographers perform examinations. Currently, many diagnotic facilities are owned my non-medical people. It's surpising to see non-medical owners running the business and making hiring decisions solely on cheap labour. I do not think non-medical professionals should be directors or managers making decisions based on who should be hired. In fact, a lot of them have no idea on how to act in the best interest of the patients and initiatives required to proivide quality imaging services.. Also, for the grandfather period, I think someone from the CMRTO or Sonography Canada should assess the competenies of the sonographers. It's only fair if a college or Sonography Canada approves the competenies of the individual sonogrpahers. Relying soley on clinical supervisor for competencies may not be fair on technologists that have gone to school in Canada and hold current registration with Sonography Canada.

According to my opinion   grandparenting offers to those who have  better clinical experience. sonographer should knows how to evaluate the pathology . the protocol of the department , how to communicate with patient and the colleagues . Every body have ARDMS , and sonography canada. these are theoritical knowledge  . but clinical knowledge is the best way to judge  sonographer. In theoritical knowldge every sonographer knows what are the ultrasound finding of the cirrhosis of liver ,BUT ,on the  clinical basis what are the basic criteria,  sonographer  should see while doing ultasound in the patient that prove liver pathology .and what techniques on ultrasound machine sonographer should use to elaborate the pathology. Theses are all can be judge only , when sonographer is in the clinical setting .SO ARDMS /Sonography canada should NOT be a  eligibility criteria for grandparenting 

Three things have become evident from reading the comments on regulation here. 1. Regulation is needed within Ontario and this is a good thing. 2. Many sonographers believe that we need to be recognized in our titles with sub-specialties in order to better protect the public. (Instead of all being blanketed as DMS we can differentiate if someone is competent in echo vs. general vs. vascular etc.) 3. CMRTO seems to not care about this concern at all. Obviously many sonographers think this would be a good thing and would better protect the public along with clarifying job capabilities. Why is the CMRTO ignoring this? Why are you even bothering to have an "open" consultation if you would not consider this? If what you want is public safety why not do this. Yet it has been dismissed and you have already made up your minds. All it would take is adding a couple of letters on the end of someone's title. This is not a difficult thing to do. 

Hi there,

I am at this point a student in an ultrasound  program at a private college,  and this Diploma course(14 months full time) is probationary aproved by the ministry of training/ education. I will have clinical placement for a number of 800 hours. Is this gone be satisfactory for me to register during the grandfathering period? 

Thank you!

CMRTO response: Initially, there will be a one-year grandparenting period starting in January 2018 to permit those individuals working competently in diagnostic medical sonography currently, or within the last three years, to apply for registration as a DMS.  You can find out more about the grandparenting period on the CMRTO website at www.cmrto.org. We will send out regular ‘DMS Updates’ as the regulations proceed.

Hello

I have been a sonographer for over 25 years . I am registered with ardms in adult echocardiography and sonography canada in abdo, ob/gyne, neuro and vascular. Which form and what documentations will I need to provide cmrto in order to apply for registration under grandparenting provisions? 

Should we not only grandfather those currently registered with sonography canada? why do we leave a loop hole for those with no canadian registration, it has become more difficult and they must pass an exam to register with sonography canada...why would we consider a tech that has not met these requirements?

i currently work with a tech with only ARDMS and feel the standard of care in canada should require them to be canadian registered...i feel like cmrto will allow them this opportunity without having to write any exam?

Hi, I am a diagnostic medical sonographer working in Ontario with 5 years of experience. I have ARDMS credentials but I donot have any credentials with Sonography Canada. I searched www.cmrto.org website and read all the queries in this forum but I still do not understand this that to be a member of CMRTO do I have to get credentials from Sonography Canada as well? What  is the eligiblity criteria to be a member of CMRTO besides 3 years of work experience? 

I have been in the diagnostic ultrasound field for around 30 years. I am not sure why the oversight of the sonography field needs to be handed over to the CMRTO. Ultrasound has nothing to do with ionizing radiation. I imaging the MRI group was so small they did not make a fuss, but we are a massive group in many sub-disciplines. There is enough diversity within our category to warrant oversight by an independent body which will spend its energy and resources focussing on upholding the standards of practice, appropriateness guidelines, conduct and malpractise, and accreditation of its members on its own.

Just because abdominal u/s, obstetrics + gynecology, IPS credentialing, small parts imaging, fetal echo, pediatric and adult echo, stressecho and contrast echo, transesophageal echo, vascular technology, womans studies/breast imaging and elastography seemed to be associated with Imaging departments in a general sense, make no mistake - medical radiation workers know absolutely nothing about this technology, and quite frankly I am insulted that I am going to arbitrarily be placed UNDER the radiation group.

Further, I now pay the ARDMS, Sonography Canada, SDMS and CSDMS. I don't need another annual dues to pay. It is getting a bit ridiculous. How many people are needed to screw in a lightbulb.

I whole heartedly disagree with the proposal to allow this inexperienced group to oversee our profession, and derive profit from attempting to administrate such a massive group which they know nothing about.   Just the same as an x-ray technologist who studies obstetrical ultrasound for 3 months and has no hands-on experience should never be trusted to see a single gestation in assessment, the CMRTO cannot claim the right to collect dues from us just because they got a few pages of background info on ultrasound and they were involved with the oversight of x-ray. Almost any other alternative sounds better to me.

I would like to be involved in this debate or consultation with representatives from the Ontario government. How can I get involved.

I await your answer. Please answer in short order.

CMRTO response: There has been much consultation by the government regarding the framework for the regulation of diagnostic medical sonographers in the public interest. You can read the Health Professions Regulatory Advisory Council’s report here http://www.hprac.org/en/resources/DS_Report_Voume_1_EN.pdf, and you can comment to the Ministry regarding the proposed regulations here http://www.ontariocanada.com/registry/view.do?postingId=24694&language=en.

As a Sonographer, I believe that the regulation of our profession will be beneficial, but I do think some of the changes should be further examined:

1) Sonographers do not use radiation to complete exams so I believe the title Diagnostic Medical Sonographer (DMS) should be the appropriate title- instead of Medical Radiation Technologist - Diagnostic Medical Sonographer (MRT-DMS).

2) I feel that the name of the college should be changed to include Sonographers - again because we do not use radiation. Perhaps an appropriate change could be the College of Medical Radiation Technologists and Sonographers of Ontario??

3)  Currently, there are more areas of practice in Sonography besides General, Vascular and Cardiac Sonography. Musculoskeletal and Breast specialties are such examples. I feel that  these should be recognized as their own specialty, especially since extra education and training is often needed in order to write the ARDMS specialty exams. If they are not included as their own specialties, would they be included under the General area of practice? And if so, would the education requirements change to prepare students to be knowledgeable in these areas right out of school?